BREAKING NEWS: The New York Times Loves IvyGate Commenters
From the New York Times Sunday Magazine article about Ivy League abstienence societies:
Chen's perspective on society, and Fredell's, was borne out in the aftermath, as people wrote in to Ivygate, calling Lena Chen a "slut," a "whore," a "total whore," a "whore whore slut." And then someone by the screen name of Sex v. Marriage wrote in to say that "most guys out there would rather end up with a girl like Janie."
My favorite? "Whore whore slut." We love you guys. Even if you are real bastards sometimes.
More BREAKING NEWS on the New York Times' far too generous approach to True Love Revolution to come.
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Read more: abstinence, anscombe, lena chen, new york times, Sex, true love revolution
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March 29th, 2008 at 4:11 pm
lol… Janie’s reasoning for the allure of virginity: “Not everyone can handle the heat. Second, not everyone has the resolve or endurance to resist the call of the wild. Popular culture justifies the common experience of all people because it is easier than embracing a practice like abstinence, one that tests the strength of each person’s body and mind.” Wow, ok… so Janie wants to test her body and mind by seeing how long she can resist sex? I’ll stick to long runs and biochemistry. It’s really sad that this is her reason… I mean, she might want to test the strength of her ability to orgasm before it’s too late. If you don’t use it, you lose it.
March 29th, 2008 at 4:31 pm
Caught red-handed engaging in anti-intellectualism, the founder of Harvard’s abstinence club said: “‘Many people on our campus were deprived of information,’ Murray told [the NYTimes reporter], and so he says he went looking through peer-reviewed journals and government sources for research that supported the abstinence view.” Last time I checked, deciding ahead of time what conclusion you will reach and mining for evidence to support that conclusion is not good research practice. But then, that’s exactly what Princeton’s Anscombe does. In fact, that is their entire mission.
March 29th, 2008 at 8:42 pm
so since i called lena chen a slut, that means i was quoted in the times right?
i think this is the second time an anonymous quote of mine appeared in a real newspaper. the first was when the spec picked up some vitriol i posted on the bwog. it seems picking up quotes off blogs counts as reporting these days.
March 30th, 2008 at 1:07 am
Safe-sex education as institutional encouragement of promiscuity? Really? Do they think that people are so dumb or so sex-hungry that if you so much as hand them a condom, they’ll go have sex with as many different people as possible?
People should be allowed to make their own decisions. Regardless of what the decision is, if it’s rational and informed, it should be respected. “Rational” and “informed” are key words here.
I can respect them for deciding to remain abstinent, but not once they start judging everyone else who doesn’t feel the same way. I also object to the way they decide to share their message. The ridiculous things they say about people who have sex, and about the sex act itself (masturbation deserves an “Oh, God, No!”, Fridell? Why? Afraid that oxytocin will make you bond with yourself too much, maybe?), don’t suggest a healthy attitude. No need to slander people who make different decisions just to uphold your own. So you don’t want to have sex. Fine! It’s your body. Do what you want with it. Just don’t be so damn judgmental about it. If you really respect your own decisions, you can exist with them without having to justify them by degrading everyone else’s.
March 30th, 2008 at 8:55 am
To say that getting rid of safe-sex education will lower the amount of sex high schoolers and college students have is ridiculous. It’s like trying to curb smoking by eliminating ash trays; it just amplifies some of the negative consequences.
That said, Chen is a whore whore slut and most guys actually would rather end up with a girl like Janie.
March 30th, 2008 at 10:55 am
To which, Cool-umbia ‘08, I must add that most guys would indeed rather end up with Janie rather than Lena, but only if faced with that particular binary choice. Outside of that choice though, I’d rather end up with a girl who knows what she wants - and wanting abstinence doesn’t count. Unless Janie marries a pastor, she will be running some serious risk of being cheated on.
March 30th, 2008 at 11:54 am
To which, Cool-umbia ‘08, I must add that most guys would indeed rather end up with Janie rather than Lena, but only if faced with that particular binary choice. Outside of that choice though, I’d rather end up with a girl who knows what she wants - and wanting abstinence doesn’t count. Unless Janie marries a pastor, she will be running some serious risk of being cheated on.
March 30th, 2008 at 12:05 pm
Dear Ivygate,
you know this already, but I thought I’d just point out once again - your commenting system is truly one of the worst I’ve seen on the interwebs.
Can you please, please fix it? That will also save you some trouble as far as removing duplicate posts is concerned.
March 30th, 2008 at 4:16 pm
I agree with Janie in that making fun of such a decision was pretty un-kosher of such a publication as the Crimson. One should respect everyone else’s decision about what to do with their own body. If they don’t want to have sex, that’s fine. If they do, also cool. You shouldn’t judge anyone because of their decision on what to do with their lives.
And to the ‘If you don’t use it, you lose it’ girl, tell that to the men holding their penises for years on end because they’re afraid it’s shrinking back into their bodies. What a stupid remark.
March 30th, 2008 at 7:25 pm
This part of the article is really awkward:
“To have that kind of self-control is really what it means to be a man,” Keliher had told me. When he finds himself aroused these days, he endures it and waits for it to pass. In this way, he said he has “matured out of that more infantile need for a woman into a recognition of self-sufficiency.” But some women, Keliher granted, continue to give him trouble.
One of these is a freshman — “a very gentle, caring soul,” he said, who “works with little kids and stuff.” Keliher can’t help thinking about her glossy hair and beautiful skin.
Another appears to be Janie Fredell. Keliher smiled and said he was “a little bit” attracted to her — “in very superficial ways,” he added. “It’s something we laugh about — if we dated.”
But Fredell did not laugh. “No!” she erupted, and with increasing volume, “No! No! No! I can’t emphasize enough that there is nothing between me and Leo! It’s just that we’re not compatible in that regard.”
March 30th, 2008 at 7:34 pm
I did indeed mean the choice being a “would you rather” kind of deal. Thanks for clarifying, littlegreenbulldog.
March 30th, 2008 at 7:46 pm
@littlegreenbulldog: We are working on an upgrade, but have limited means and quite a few bugs that require our attention, so we ask you to bear the arcane comment system just a little longer. In the meantime, click “post” only once and have faith your comment will, eventually, appear.
March 30th, 2008 at 7:59 pm
Wait…so you’re telling me you’re not rolling in the dough that a gossip site of such prominence and importance as IvyGate would expectedly provide? John Sidney McCain advertises on your website. For shame.
March 30th, 2008 at 8:29 pm
Oh good, someone else agrees with me.
Also, can we take a moment to reflect upon the way Keliher talks about sex and lust? Creeper much? And headed for seminary school? Um, awesome…
March 30th, 2008 at 8:55 pm
there’s actually quite a bit of medical evidence suggesting that the more women practice (re: masturbate) the healthier their orgasmic abilities are. so it wasn’t a stupid remark at all. but what the hell were you talking about with the shrinking penises? i like to think of myself as pretty knowledgeable about sex-related stuff… but you stumped me with that one.please provide a link.
March 30th, 2008 at 9:04 pm
I must add that most guys would indeed rather end up with Janie rather than Lena, but only if faced with that particular binary choice.
Well, “most” guys are a little bit retarded, then. Having a girl like Lena fall head over heels for you would mean something about your entire person, instead of Janie’s stark cerebral approval of your morals and conversational skills.
March 30th, 2008 at 9:22 pm
would you rather have a freak in both the sheets and on the street or a lady (in the worse sense of the word) in the sheets and on the street? i’ll go with the first choice… lena would make any man 10 times happier than janie would.
March 30th, 2008 at 9:30 pm
…in theory perhaps. In practice it seems to be the opposite.
March 30th, 2008 at 11:00 pm
Judging by the picture of Janie on NYT (and the many pictures of Lena in various stages of dress available on the internet), I would say that Janie is hotter than Lena but she has this angry/upset look that getting railed or at least masturbating once in a while would probably get rid of.
March 31st, 2008 at 1:17 am
I’ve criticized Lena in the past and think she has some growing up to do. However, her recent step out of the spotlight was clear evidence of humanity (vs. being a fame/attention whore). With some maturity, I’d take Lena in a heartbeat — both for conversational skills and appreciating the value of getting flat-out, sweaty, dirty, squealing, sloppy fucked. Anyone who can’t admit to even a modicum of pleasure from that is a liar or has problems.
March 31st, 2008 at 4:22 am
@m: ok, I might actually back out a bit. But by “end up,” I mean “get married to and live happily with ever after.” Would I rather have a nymphomaniac or a frigid “lady in my sheets”? Would I rather shoot off my left nut or my right nut? I don’t know, tough call.
March 31st, 2008 at 4:49 am
ivygate: this is a little too wakka wakka to be interesting.
March 31st, 2008 at 8:42 am
nympho, of course… unless you would like to only have sex missionary style once a week at best. r u crzy?
March 31st, 2008 at 9:33 am
not everyone who waits for marriage just wants to have sex once a week in the missionary position.
/waited until marriage
//every position, bitches
///girl
March 31st, 2008 at 10:54 am
this is only a test.
March 31st, 2008 at 12:24 pm
the once-a-week-missionary-style-only remark was referring primarily to janie (not all abstinent people). although i would venture to say that it applies to many.
March 31st, 2008 at 12:29 pm
Exactly. Just because I want to wait doesn’t mean I don’t want it now - I’m as red-blooded as the next girl. Waiting til marriage means having a lot of time to make up for.
March 31st, 2008 at 8:24 pm
as long as we’re on the subject my personal preference would be a menage-a-trois with jane & lena. that would surely be a great (combustible) experience.
promiscuity vs abstinence. slut vs prude. two extremes, neither realistic. impaled on the horns of a dilemma. the false dichotomy/dilemma. not an either-or, is it?? is there middle ground?
it seems as if there are two warring religious dogmas here.
isnt it amazing how complex sex is?
it seems a lot can be traced to st Augustine, who in his youth was a hedonist enjoyer of brothels, and had a concubine later in life. the start of the false judeo-christian sanctimony/repression/authoritarianism.
for those with an open mind & interested in some real research, look into “tantra” eg in a book called “tantric quest” by odier. (or another book by him) .. try this too
tantra yoga & khajuraho
http://www.ourchart.com/node/307171
April 1st, 2008 at 9:10 pm
wow, i guess i may not be normal, but i’d definitely go for the slut. no question.
the virgin scares me. she seems waaay too tense.
and the horny priest (or should i saw future sex offender?). goodness. someone give him a handjob, stat. it’s for the children.
April 1st, 2008 at 9:17 pm
just saw a pic of lena chen. ooh, this is tricky now. but still. the hardcore virgin scares me.
referring to the article - what’s up with all that hormone stuff? is that what the crazy promise keepers tell themselves? i’ve taken a good bit of biology, and i’ve never head such a thing. will have to google, but wow. that poor girl is crazy.
April 3rd, 2008 at 12:10 am
wow. no. but. wow. uh, hadn’t seen that. i’m thinking there should be a get together with her and razzy. i’m not interested in pictures, it just sounds like they’d hit it off.
April 3rd, 2008 at 1:07 pm
In the Janie v. Lena choice, I’d take Lena in a second. Janie’s just waiting till marriage to pussywhip someone, though she’s happy to break plenty of balls in terms of disposable boyfriends before then. I’d never date anyone that cold and angry.